The Gift of a Viewing Podcast Episode Transcript

Content Warning: In this episode, we discuss traumatic death, suicide, and infant loss.

I have a lot of people reach out to me with cases and different scenarios. They'll preface it with, well, they're not sure if they're going to view or not, should I do it? And I always encourage them if the family is allowing you to do it, whether they're going to choose to see them or not do it.

~Amanda Marie Ellis King

GAIL MARQUARDT:
Welcome to the Remembering a Life podcast. I'm your host, Gail Marquardt. My guest today is Amanda King. Amanda is an embalmer and director for BC Bailey Funeral Home in Wallingford, Connecticut. She specializes in embalming and postmortem reconstructive work and is also an educator who teaches reconstructive work and cosmetic application. Welcome Amanda. I'm so glad you could join me today.

AMANDA MARIE ELLIS KING:
Hi, Gail. Thank you so much for having me on. I really appreciate it.

GAIL MARQUARDT:
Being a funeral director is already one of those jobs that I think people don't know a whole lot about, and you also specialize in embalming and restorative art. Can you tell me a little bit about why you chose funeral service as a career and what drew you ultimately to specializing in embalming and restorative art?

AMANDA MARIE ELLIS KING:
So this actually was not my first career by any means. It maybe might've been number 2, 3, 4, somewhere in there. At the time I discovered mortuary science being a field that you could go into and not just have come up into it through your family owning a funeral home. I was already teaching for a Montessori school. I taught Montessori toddlers in primary level, and I stumbled upon it at the local community college down the street from me with my pre-reqs. It was going to be a one-year program for me to get a degree, and so I went for it. It intrigued me. I have a heavy art background with my other degrees and it ended up beautifully marrying so many things that I found important in my life. So that's kind of how I stumbled into it. When I was in mortuary school, I will never forget taking restorative art and the instructor at the time, he was a bit older and I got very excited for the artistic aspect of restorative art to the point that I remember raising my hand and asking, can you just do this in the field? Can you just do reconstruction and restorative stuff? And I kind of got laughed at and was told absolutely not. It's not really a thing anymore, but we teach it because it's part of the curriculum. And so I was kind of disappointed when I left class that day. It was like I had finally saw that silver lining in the program where I was like, oh, this is definitely a true calling because I can really use my art background for this. And then it getting squashed all in a few hours. However, once I graduated and got into the field, I was in Colorado at the time, so there was no licensing then though there is now. And I decided to leave the state to find an apprenticeship because I wanted to get licensing to elevate my professional status, I guess, and then moved back to Colorado. But when I was out searching for an apprenticeship, I met Vernie Fountain, who is just world renowned for doing reconstructive work and doing exactly what I want to do that I thought was a possibility in that one class one night. And after talking to him for several hours during actually the NFDA convention in Boston many years ago, we continued talking afterwards and he took me on as an apprentice. And it just has been a whirlwind since then. I cannot even begin to describe the amount of knowledge and care and reverence that he's instilled in me and that I hope to continue to spread within our community and out there to the public as well.

GAIL MARQUARDT:
That's great. I remember when I first started doing this work in funeral service and I heard about Vernie Fountain and I quickly learned what a big deal Vernie Fountain is in the area of embalming. So how wonderful that you got to study under him.

AMANDA MARIE ELLIS KING:
Yes, it was one of those things that I did not even realize at the time what it meant. Stepping into those shoes and apprenticing under him and I every single day am grateful for that experience and having him in my life to continually not only support me, but just bounce ideas off of him and continually learn from him and network through him to amazing other embalmers and reconstructive individuals out in the entire world. It's not even just here in the United States. I feel such a need to stress that it is just international in what we do.

GAIL MARQUARDT:
Yeah, that's a great point. So doing this work, as someone who is a specialist in reconstruction, I imagine you work with numerous families whose loved ones have died tragically, and you may have made it possible for them to view the body of their loved one. Why is that so important?

AMANDA MARIE ELLIS KING:
I think it is extremely, extremely important because we need to be able to give them a choice. I think it is our duty and our professional duty to be able to empower families in this very low moment of their lives, to be able to give back some control. And by being able to give back their loved one, they're able to not only have that chance again that they thought was robbed of them and thus empower them, but also be able to give them a more peaceful mental image in their head, especially if it was very traumatic so that they don't need to spend the rest of their lives wondering what their mother, brother, daughter might look like or have looked like at the end of their life and being left like that. I'll speak to one case in particular. It was a young girl. She was very young and there was a tragic accident in which her skull was completely crushed and this was the visual that her family had because they saw it happen.

And so by being able to reconstruct her, not only was I able to correct that image in their head because they were able to see her again, but just the fact that she was whole again. And I was very transparent with the family. They wanted to know every step of the process. And the way that I do that for families is I'll use a lot of medical terminology to keep it a little bit sterile when they're asking questions like that. But it was extremely important to them to know that every single part of her skull was put back together to how it should have been, that essentially she was whole again. And even just knowing that just gave them so much more ease in the situation. So I have a lot of people reach out to me with cases and different scenarios and they'll preface it with, well, they're not sure if they're going to view or not. They're not sure if they're going to view or not, should I do it? And I always encourage them, if the family is allowing you to do it, whether they're going to choose to see them or not do it, because right then and there you've restored that image in their head that their loved one isn't going into death broken or in parts or pieces, that they're whole again and they're restored to themselves again out of respect and reverence.

GAIL MARQUARDT:
It really is a gift to the families. Last year, I believe it was, I had the honor of interviewing some of the funeral directors who helped families after the Columbine shooting. And one of the funeral directors said the one wish that these families had was that they wanted to see their child. So they made sure that every single family could have a viewing of their loved one. It's so important and perhaps even more important when someone does die tragically like that. But why do you think overall a viewing is important? Even if a loved one didn't die traumatically,

AMANDA MARIE ELLIS KING:
I think it automatically instills in someone the idea that the death has occurred, that they can't mentally run away from the fact that their loved one has died. They can't trick themselves that well, maybe they're out there alive somewhere. And this is also something that we've seen psychologically happen in events of mass death such as 9/11 where bodies weren't recovered and there was nothing for families to see, to touch, to hold something tangible for them to know a hundred percent that their loved one is dead. And this even goes back to the Civil War when bodies were either buried in place and families didn't know if their loved ones were killed in battle or not. And a lot of soldiers did just slip out and start their life new and just never contacted anyone again. So I think the psychology of actually seeing and knowing that someone you love and care about is dead is very important. I'll share one story. So I am coming up to a year anniversary of one of my best friends having died, and I went and took care of his body because that's what I mean he would've wanted. Plus he had always talked about jokingly, when it's someone out of the industry with someone in the industry, oh, when I die, will you do this or this or this?

He died unexpectedly. And I will never forget interacting with his mom. And his mom had a very deep religious belief system instilled with her from her church that the body didn't matter. It was all about the soul. And when she got there, she knew that I had embalmed him as he would've wanted and restored him so that he could be seen. Because when I got him into my care at first we would consider not viewable. He needed a lot of restorative work. And she asked me to go into the room with him. And I'll never forget sitting in the chairs with her and her telling me how she had been told and taught no matter what the body doesn't matter that it shouldn't matter. She shouldn't even have to be there for her to understand that her son is dead and that her belief he's in heaven, et cetera.

But she held my hand and looked me dead in the eye and said, but that's my son there and my God, no one's going to stop me from holding my son again. And she went right over to his body and pretty much picked him up out of his casket and held him no matter his age or whatnot, that was still her son. And she looked at me and said, thank you so much for letting me have the choice to do this. And she spent hours there with his body continually touching, hugging, kissing him. And so that experience for me was so powerful because no matter what people might believe or think they believe when they're put in that situation with it right in front of them, that might not be what they need. They might instinctually know what they need. And oftentimes that is seeing and touching the body after death.

GAIL MARQUARDT:
Well, once again, what an amazing gift that you gave his mother and yourself, really, losing such a good friend. A friend of mine died nine years ago and he died in another state. It was very sudden, it was a suicide, and his family insisted that his body was not viewable, so they were going to cremate his body out there and then fly the cremated remains back. I did talk to them about, well, you can probably hold a hand, or even if the body isn't entirely viewable, you can still hold a hand. I wanted to hold his hand, but they insisted that they weren't going to do that. So even to this day, there's a little part of me that doesn't entirely believe that he's dead. In that instance, how can even holding a hand be helpful?

AMANDA MARIE ELLIS KING:
Death is palpable. It really is. I have seen it time and time again with cases I've had. I mean, I've done reconstructive cases not only of traumatic accidents or motor vehicle accidents. I've done gunshot wounds, self-inflicted gunshot wounds, hanging decapitation, railroad accidents, railroad suicide, and I've done plane crash victims. And in fact, one plane crash, victim comes to mind. You hear your loved one died in a plane crash, you automatically assume there's nothing really that you can see. And this woman from one of them, it was her husband that had died and she just begged the director for even just sitting in the room with his body before cremation. She just wanted to sit in the room with his body. She promised not to touch. She promised not she didn't even care. She had to sit in the opposite side of the room. That's how important it was to her.

And so when we got him into our care, I was able to make about half his face viewable and then part of the hands. And so I made, we'd done that. I made a special sheet that covered most of him except for the parts that she could see. We got him into the room and we let her right in. And I told her, you can touch him, you can kiss him, you can, whatever you need, spend as much time as you want. She came in every single day to spend time with his body before the cremation had to happen before services. And every single day she would bring in little notes or letters or anything that she wanted put with him. And because the rest of his body was very, very damaged, I actually sewed a little pocket onto the sheet. It was like a little envelope pocket that she tucks things in to be with him.
I think especially in this day and age, we very easily can trick our minds that someone could be elsewhere, but seeing really is believing. And so many people in our industry will say that you'll hear us say time and time again, seeing is believing, but it really is true because then it's right in front of you and you have to face it. You can't push it out of view. You can't say, oh, I'm going to think about it later. You can't distract yourself. You have to start working on it. Start that grief journey. Yeah. And I oftentimes will encourage families if they don't want their loved one reconstructed, if they don't want anything done, do you want come in and touch their hand, see their hand at least or something. Or I offer photos and I'll offer them. I can print them. I can seal 'em in an envelope and seal that envelope in another envelope. So if you think you're ready and you want to view or you need something that's there for you, something tangible,

GAIL MARQUARDT:
That's a really good idea. I haven't heard of other funeral directors doing that. I bet they do.

AMANDA MARIE ELLIS KING:
And that is something that, especially I also have a background in photography, so that always, photography always comes to mind for me. I mean, that's part of our American death tradition as well, taking photos because postmortem photography in the US was important because that's how people proved to others that their loved one was dead. There used to be painting before that, but when photography really became a thing, they would do the post-mortem photography and they would save up money, especially for children once that they could at least have a photo of their child. But two, to prove to others that they were deceased if maybe they weren't going to see other family members for years or so because of having moved away. But I especially offer it for families of children, especially babies and stillbirths or miscarriages, where more than likely the family was never even offered photos in the hospital.

And I'll offer them to families two ways. One, like I mentioned, printing them, putting 'em in an envelope sealed in another envelope because I always want a second layer of protection in case they decide they want to open it, but then change their mind so it's not just blurring right in their face or offering it digitally on a thumb drive or a flash drive. And same idea there. I'll put the photos in a folder, I put that folder in another folder, then put that on the flash drive. So when they open the flash drive, they don't immediately pop up. They can sit there and think again, do I really want to do this now or Or was that just the first baby step and maybe I'm not ready.

GAIL MARQUARDT:
At a prior job, before I worked in funeral service, I had a coworker whose baby was stillborn and she had a photo of her holding the baby on her desk at work.

AMANDA MARIE ELLIS KING:
Oh, I love that.

GAIL MARQUARDT:
Well, I was hearing all these rumors about, oh my goodness, how inappropriate. I can't believe she has that picture of that baby who's dead on her desk. I called her, she's in a different department, and I knew her, but not super well. And I said, you know what? I heard that you have a photo of your child on your desk. I'd really like to come see it. And she said, you are the only person who has done this and who has cared enough and understood why I would want to have this photo with me. And the baby was beautiful. So we talked about that, and I was very disappointed in my coworkers that they weren't able to kind of see why that would be helpful for her.

AMANDA MARIE ELLIS KING: Oh yeah.

GAIL MARQUARDT:
So I love what you're doing. I've heard that there are some photographers now who are specializing in postmortem photography and photography at the funeral as well, right?

AMANDA MARIE ELLIS KING:
Oh, yes, there definitely are. And it's something that, I mean, I will say this, it is much more prevalent in Europe, and I hope, at least right now, and I hope it swings back to the US and becomes more of a thing here, one beauty of social media that I've seen. And at two in the morning, everyone gets onto a different sides of the internet that you don't know exist. And many years ago, I found the side of social media where families were posting photos and videos and their only moments that they have with their deceased children, whether it be a miscarriage, a stillbirth, an infant baby, their small child in the hospital. And it's not to make money off of, it's not for shock in awe. It's for healing and it's for grief. And it has created this interesting community on social media of these families that post these videos and photos and images, and it helps keep your little one alive in the present time by doing this.

And I don't think a lot of people realize that unless maybe they were put in that situation. And so especially the children that I take care of, this is something I always bring up to families and ask them. And it's something that it's always a little bit nerve wracking to bring up, and I always just have to have confidence to bring it up to families because whenever I talk with families or meet with them, I want them to always be able to choose from a place of wholeness rather than partial awareness because I never want a family, no matter who might've died to them, find out 10 years down the road, oh, we could have done this, but I didn't know that at the time. I want to be able to educate families to every possibility that I know I can achieve for them so that they can choose from that. And so photography is one thing that I bring up, especially to pediatric families. I get worried that families might be offended or get upset. Then I often share with them these videos that I've seen on social media that are so tasteful and beautiful and often shot by professional photographers or videographers. And every single time families have said, yes, I want that. I do want that. One story that comes to mind is a traumatic death of a young child. And she had a lot of siblings, and it was a reconstructing case as well.

I mentioned to the family, to the parents because a lot of the siblings are still so very young that their grief might cloud them from everything that's going on right now. And they're most likely not going to remember this. It might be a blur. And suggested to them to hire a photographer or someone to also video the funeral service as well, because we were having it be very child-centric and it was involving her classmates and a lot of children, a lot of moving parts. And they came back and said, actually, yeah, we would like to do that because the worst case scenario is those photos sit somewhere and that video sits somewhere they're never looked at, but at least they have it rather than never having it. And after a few months, the entire family looked at the photos, watched the videos, and the mom has shared with me that times where she's missing her daughter most her most comforting thing to do is to go back and watch the funeral video and watch her service. And that brings her so much comfort and so much closeness, and she gets to see her body again. And I just felt like that's so powerful and that just pushes me to always keep mentioning this to families. That is an option.

GAIL MARQUARDT:
What a testament to the work that you did with that family planning, a meaningful service and then ensuring that they would be able to revisit that experience whenever they felt the need to do so, or if their children wanted to do so. Again, you give families so many gifts.

AMANDA MARIE ELLIS KING:
Well, and it was also a point where you think like, oh, you won't want to watch the funeral service again because it's sad. But funerals are so important because, and just like the video shows to them, their whole community rallied behind them and supported them, and everyone was there in person and paying attention to each other. They were not connected by phones or technology at that point. They were in person with each other, supporting, hugging, loving each other. And to watch video of that and to see that support and be constantly reminded of that support is the other side of funerals. It's not just to have a sad event, it's to see and feel the support from your family and your community and your chosen family.

GAIL MARQUARDT:
Right. So how do you work with families? You mentioned that in this case, children came to the funeral, classmates came. How do you work with families to determine what might be appropriate for their child as part of that experience? Some parents are very hesitant to have their children even come to funerals, let alone view the body of someone. What might be the benefits of having them do that?

AMANDA MARIE ELLIS KING:
That is a very big question and one that I love. So there's a lot of parts to that. One thing that I will always bring up to families, especially if there's siblings involved or children involved or active young grandkids around is are they going to be a part of the service? Or especially if they're siblings, are they allowed to make some decisions alongside you, especially if they're maybe a bit older, 12, 13, 14? Are you going to take their thoughts, wishes, et cetera into consideration too when making decisions, especially about disposition or services? I am a firm believer, and I know this because I have taught toddlers and young kids, if you're honest with them, they get it, but you have to be honest with them. For example, my daughter who's five now going on six, and now I've got a one and a half year old, I am very open with them with what I do.

My five-year-old could verbally talk about what it means to be dead when she was three, how your body stops working and your body doesn't feel anything. And the simple scientific mechanics behind it, it's not them going to sleep, they're not asleep, et cetera, don't use euphemisms, et cetera. But when I have families that have children actively involved with the dying experience or death experience, I like to ask them how we can involve them and almost make the assumption that we will be involving them. And I've never really had pushback from that approach, but more questions and curiosity. And there's many ways that you can feel that. There's a lot of books out there nowadays. I write a monthly article in the American Funeral Director each month about a different kid's book that talks about death that for the most part is non-religious. So that it's useful for anyone to be able to use as well as discussion points to have with it and to open up the conversation because I fully believe, and I've lived it with my kids and kids, I've taught that if you talk about death in everyday life, it is a part of everyday life.

It's normal. It's not something that's hidden or scared. And this was actually something I talked about extensively with that family in particular that we had a very child-centric service that they videotaped, is that the death of their daughter who was in elementary school was going to be the first death that many children in her class in school will have experienced. And so they didn't know how to approach it. She had a lot of close friends that they felt were going to be just as affected as her siblings in losing her. And I of course said, well, they should come see her come be a part of it. And then we talked about the entire service becoming child-centric because I made the point to them that at this very moment, the way that all these children are going to look at death is going to be shaped by their decisions with their daughter, that they hold the power in their hands to show these children that death can be gentle, that it can be calm, that it can be supportive, that it can be loving, that it can be beautiful, and not something that's scary hidden away.
We don't talk about, we don't see they had that power in their hands that very moment and continually, as I talked to them throughout that whole experience and even afterwards, that has always stuck with them, that power they held in their hands to control what death looks like to these other children. And of course, other families had to come and say, okay, yeah, we're going to bring our kids. But when they explained it that way, the entire community supported that idea. And the photos they sent me, all the photos and video from that day, the photos are beautiful because the initial photos are when everyone saw her for the first time in the casket, and all the children's faces are, they're quiet, they're calm, they're inquisitive, and they're just looking. But it's a look as if they're still friends that while death may have taken her physical body, that's still their friend there. They're still recognizable, they're still someone they love. And as the service progressed and the photos progressed, they had the casket open not only for the service or visitation, but they did a repas afterwards where everyone had lunch and still gathered together and they had her there with the casket open for that as well. And the photos that they got of the children coming up to her, they're putting bracelets on her hands, they're touching her, they're playing with their hair, but their faces, they're smiling,

They're looking warm, they're happy, they're not scared. It's not something that got hidden from them. It's something that they saw. It is okay to embrace and it is okay to approach and is okay to talk about and that's good and that's healthy.

GAIL MARQUARDT:
Wouldn't it be amazing if we saw a shift from those younger generations into a society where we are more open and willing to talk about death? Because what you're describing is the polar opposite of what I experienced 50 years ago attending my first funeral. And I think a lot of people in my generation are hesitant to talk about death, talk about funerals, and does that all stem from those experiences that we had when we were young? This gives me hope that maybe these younger generations will inspire all of us to have healthier conversations about death.

AMANDA MARIE ELLIS KING:
Can you share what your first experience was like? Is it okay if I ask?

GAIL MARQUARDT:
Yes, that's fine. It was my grandfather and the funeral was at a church, a very large church, and his body was in a casket up at the front. And as we walked in, there was very dark organ music being played. And I can still see him at the front of the church. I can see the profile of him in the casket. Yeah, I do not remember going up to view his body. I'm wondering if maybe I didn't, but I remember having to sit in that pew and be really quiet. And I remember even at that time thinking, oh, this doesn't feel right. And I was like, I dunno, six. But that was my first experience.

AMANDA MARIE ELLIS KING:
And I'll share her service again because I mean, her service is just the epitome of a child-centric service, and that's just kind of what I dubbed them. It opened up with her casket in the front of church, but with all her classmates and siblings behind it singing. And that's how her service opened. And it was just so beautiful. And throughout the service, they let her siblings speak and some of her friends speak, but also she really enjoyed writing and writing plays and skits and making up songs. And so throughout the eulogies that were so heavy by the adults and sad, and you could just feel the weight of them sprinkled in between, those were her skits and her songs done by her siblings and her friends that just brought such a lightheartedness and just brought her whole spirit to the service, if that makes any sense. And I'm just so grateful that this family embraced this approach and really ran with it.

GAIL MARQUARDT:
It really is. It sounds absolutely beautiful, a mix of really intense grieving, I'm sure, but also celebrating this very young life. It sounds beautiful, and thank you for the incredible work that you've done, not only with that family, but with so many families. I do have to ask, so anyone thinking about becoming a funeral director, but they're unsure about pursuing it, especially when you get to the embalming part. What would you say to them if they're unsure about their direction?

AMANDA MARIE ELLIS KING:
The first thing off the bat is I ask them if they're willing to approach any of their local funeral homes to see if they can just go shadow, because funeral service has so many layers. It depends on where you live. It depends on what type of funeral homes are around you, whether they're family-owned or corporate. It depends on the atmosphere inside the funeral home. One atmosphere might be great and healthy. There might be a toxic atmosphere and another one. But I think it's important to really see what you might be getting into or talk to other professionals in the field before you get into it. Because there is a high dropout of people that have gone to mortuary school, gone into the field, and then burnout after four or five years or realize they can't have the life that they thought they could diving into it.

But that could also change. And so when I've spoken at some state associations, I always have students come up to me and I love talking and meeting with students and apprentices. And I'll never forget at one, the association one came up to me and she was like, basically I had done a reconstructive presentation. And she was like, that's exactly what I wanted to do, but everyone around me won't do it. They said, it can be done. And she's restricted to very strict service format for how she works at the funeral home. And she was on the verge of tears. And I looked at her and I said, what is holding you here? And she just looked very confused at me and I said, are you willing to move? And she goes, well, yeah. I said, I think your approach to funeral service doesn't work with wherever you're living right now, but I do know other parts of the country and or world where you would fit in perfectly and you would feel the support and community that you're looking for in funeral service. And she just was like, I've never had anyone say that to me before. I didn't know that was an option. I was like, it's always an option to move.

But I will say from the inside, and this is something you don't really realize until you're on the inside. Funeral service looks very different across the United States. It looks very different across the world. I have had the honor, and I'm very grateful for the experience to be able to work abroad and embalm abroad. And I always joke every single time I do it that I wish that the US had some sort of exchange program with other parts of the world, because I feel like the way that the US teaches funeral service and embalming, it's almost like we've got horse blinders on. And if they could see not only different ways that things are done across the world in different countries, but also the way that things are thought about differently, it would just be eye-opening and it might bring in some better ideas to our own little part of the world.

The other thing that I very much bring up with students is I will ask them, do you plan to have a family with funeral service? Having a lot of women come into the field, I will say from experience, it can be very hot or cold when a woman in funeral service goes to start a family and not only go to start a family, but also afterwards. I mean, you've got childcare afterwards. I have a lot of women in the field that have wanted to start families or just start a families ask me a lot about breastfeeding and breast pumping, for example. How do you do that on the job? My boss is making me go do a service that's five hours away and I have to drive the hearse, but I need to pump. What do I do? These are all real things that I think are going to be more prevalent in questions that are going to be asked more within our field that we have to take into consideration, especially for people that are coming into the field, but also those of us already here and trying to create healthy environments for those coming in, even if it wasn't healthy for us.

GAIL MARQUARDT:
Definitely. And with 70% of mortuary science graduates being women, this is going to be very prevalent. And so you raise really good points that when people are considering going into this field, there is a lot to consider. But I also know that for the people who have been in it 10, 15, 20, 25 years, they say they can't imagine doing anything else but going into it.

AMANDA MARIE ELLIS KING:
A hundred percent.

GAIL MARQUARDT:
Yeah, going into it with your eyes open is really important.

AMANDA MARIE ELLIS KING:
And Gail, it actually takes a funeral home to raise a child, not a village. I'll tell you that.

GAIL MARQUARDT:
Oh, that's a really good point. Right. So I ask each of my guests this question, who are you remembering today?

AMANDA MARIE ELLIS KING:
I do a lot of pediatric cases. I constantly remember every single child I've taken care of all the time, all of them pop into my head all the time. And I kind of wish I could tell the parents that, but I stop myself because that could be a painful thing to hear from your funeral director or the field director that served you. But some of them I do reach out to. But when I was talking with you about doing this podcast, and I had already mentioned him, but the first person that always pops into my head is my friend Joe, that I took care of last year, mostly because I mean, it was unexpected and it affected me directly. So I then sat in the shoes of many of the families I've cared for, except my experience was different because I also was the one caring for his body. And the experience of caring for his body was so incredibly therapeutic for me. I had a lot of embalmer and industry friends worry about me if it was going to be too much or too heavy. And I of course said, no, no, no, no, no. I need to do this. This is what he would've wanted. I was like, I'm the only person that knows. He never wanted eye caps put in, so I need to make sure he doesn't have eye caps.
But the opportunity to care for his physical vessel was so therapeutic for me that it constantly made me wonder and think, how much more therapeutic can this be for other families to be able to care for the body of their loved one, even if it is just a ritual, bathing, washing, dressing. And so with all the children's cases, especially, I offer that to families all the time. Again, always let them choose from a place of wholeness rather than partial awareness. But every single time the families take me up on the offer.

And one time in particular, it was a neonatal death. I want to say the baby was only maybe 16 weeks gestation. Parents were told, not viable by the hospital. They never got to see the baby in the hospital. And that can mean a number of things for us. But I always tell the parents, let me get the baby into my care. Get the baby into my care. The baby is whole. You can see there is some trauma, but it's nothing that is too crazy. And so I reach out to the family and I say, do you want to come in and bathe your baby and dress your baby because they had chosen cremation? I always usually ask families if especially babies are further along that have nursery set up, can I bring the baby home for you? Every single family says yes, because they never thought they'd have the chance to.

This family hadn't had a nursery set up yet. So I offered for them to care for the child in the funeral home. And I always say, this is an option and choice for each of you individually. Just because one of you says no, doesn't mean the other one of you has to say, no, it's okay. It's okay for you guys to have different needs of grief at this point. And so the mom came in, the dad decided he didn't want to. Mom came in, she held her little one. I sat there right with her. She bathed the baby. I had everything set. I had little diapers. She got to put a diaper on the baby for the first time. She got to put this little onesie on them little hat swaddle for the first time and hold. And afterwards, she had given me the baby and she was getting ready to leave.

And she just looked me right in the eye and said, thank you for giving me the chance to care. She said, that's all I ever wanted with this baby, was a chance to just be able to care for them and to give them something. And you let me do that today. And so going back to Joe, I was able to care for his body. And I was so grateful for that opportunity and I saw firsthand and how important it is because that's still our loved one. Even if they're not there, that's still a part of them. It's still important. If I put, I kept in him, he'd probably be haunting me today, but I'd probably want that. I should have done it. And so I think back to him constantly. I truly believe that caring for his body and the experience with him, and I don't know if I said it or not, he chose to end his own life as well. It made me a more thoughtful embalmer. And I think of anything to strive for in this industry when it comes to being an embalmer or funeral director. For anyone that's interested in getting into any part of it, you don't need to be the best. You don't need be the greatest. You don't need to be an expert. But to be a thoughtful embalmer, a thoughtful funeral director, I think is the most important of anything.

GAIL MARQUARDT:
Well, you create beautiful experiences for people who are at perhaps the lowest time in their life, and that is so incredibly meaningful, and it comes through in every single story that you've told today. Thank you for sharing the story about Joe. My heart goes out to you. Grief after a suicide is definitely a different kind of grief. So I feel for you with regard to that. Thank you for sharing a little bit about him, and thank you for sharing the stories of the other families that you've served. You're in the right place. You're doing such amazing work for families.

AMANDA MARIE ELLIS KING:
I appreciate that.

GAIL MARQUARDT:
It just comes through in every word that you say. So thank you so much for joining me today, Amanda, and just thank you again for the amazing work that you do.

AMANDA MARIE ELLIS KING:
Thank you so much for having me on Gail, and for having these conversations and sharing what you did as well.

GAIL MARQUARDT:
For more information about becoming a funeral director, if Amanda has inspired you today and I don't know how she can't have, visit RememberingALife.com/Careers. And for more information about remembering loved ones after they die, check out all the resources we have on RememberingALife.com.